I have made my thoughts on this known. I utterly oppose any total opt-out mechanism for global groups. It rather defeats the purpose of a global group, not existing on a few wikis.

That said, I am open to the possibility of groups applying on "sets" of wikis, for instance, "small wikis", and so on.

ayg wrote:

Any opt-out, of course, needs to be per-group. If stewards are a global group, nobody will be allowed to opt out of them, obviously; but wikis may legitimately want to opt out of global sysops; and an entirely different set of wikis may want to opt out of global bots.

millosh wrote:

I think that it would be good to allow such possibility to particular projects.
They would need to make the policy for opting-out, which means that they will
have to pass through the process at their wikis. I think that the majority of
projects which may opt-out wouldn't opt-out. Even en.wp made a supportive
policy for global sysops.

However, other option would be good enough for solving problems, too.

And, yes, I agree with Simetrical's position.

This needs much more thought than that. An opt-in could be one of the options. After SUL settles down, one might think about cross-project permissions, may be in form of groups of wikis. Why aren't small wikis inviting people to sysop there?

I know that global groups are easy to implement, but this does not necessary mean we have to do it "because we can".

(In reply to comment #4)

...Why aren't small wikis inviting people to sysop
there?

Arguably, the small wikis don't even know global sysops exist.

millosh wrote:

So, to be more precise, the option should be implemented in the next way:

• Stewards should be able to grant to local bureaucrats a new menu for a particular group. Such option will be given only to the large wikis. (see [1]).
• At the menu local bureaucrats will be able to check and uncheck global rights for their own wiki (like stewards now may do globally). While it will be unchecking at the most of the times, it is possible to suppose that some projects would willing to give some more rights to global sysops (or any other group).
• Of course, policy related to granting this option to the local bureaucrats will assume that they will need to have the policy toward those roles and permissions (written in English) before they get it.

[1] - http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global_sysops/Small_and_large_wikis

ayg wrote:

(In reply to comment #6)

So, to be more precise, the option should be implemented in the next way:

• Stewards should be able to grant to local bureaucrats a new menu for a

particular group. Such option will be given only to the large wikis. (see [1]).

• At the menu local bureaucrats will be able to check and uncheck global rights

for their own wiki (like stewards now may do globally). While it will be
unchecking at the most of the times, it is possible to suppose that some
projects would willing to give some more rights to global sysops (or any other
group).

Adding rights is potentially a little scary, depending on what rights are made available. For instance, clearly bureaucrats should never be able to give any group the 'userrights' right. Subtracting rights makes more sense.

My intention is to allow stewards to define groups of wikis as including or excluding specific wikis. Stewards will then specify which groups of wikis a global group will apply to. This seems to be the most sensible option.

millosh wrote:

(In reply to comment #8)

My intention is to allow stewards to define groups of wikis as including or
excluding specific wikis. Stewards will then specify which groups of wikis a
global group will apply to. This seems to be the most sensible option.

This seems fine to me.

BTW, sorry if it seems like a pressure, but I would like to know what amount of time you need for doing that? (If you need 6 months, it's OK, I would just like to know an approximation.)

millosh wrote:

(In reply to comment #8)

My intention is to allow stewards to define groups of wikis as including or
excluding specific wikis. Stewards will then specify which groups of wikis a
global group will apply to. This seems to be the most sensible option.

BTW, may you allow to stewards to adapt permissions per project? For example, en.wp community thinks that rollback is fine for global sysops, which means that global sysops should keep that permission there. Other may think that blocking proxies are OK, too; etc.

ayg wrote:

(In reply to comment #8)

My intention is to allow stewards to define groups of wikis as including or
excluding specific wikis. Stewards will then specify which groups of wikis a
global group will apply to. This seems to be the most sensible option.

It might be unnecessarily roundabout. I suspect you'd have one group of wikis defined per global group, in which case you may as well get rid of the idea of specifying the group of wikis in a separate step and just have a list per global group.

cometstyles wrote:

Any update on this ? ...

Fixed in r37975.

millosh wrote:

Thanks Vasilev! :)

Note this was reverted pending some post-review fixes.

Thanks, it seems to be live again (marked as fixed).

Yep, current version should be live since a few days ago. Report if any further problems.