I am considering to take this over after T229293 is fixed. Besides site.py is there any other place where we allow dualism?

config2.py needs to emit a warning that sysopnames don't work anymore (if we decide to just break it)

Change 532713 had a related patch set uploaded (by Huji; owner: Huji):
[pywikibot/core@master] Deprecate sysopnames

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/532713

In T71283#5433037, @zhuyifei1999 wrote:

config2.py needs to emit a warning that sysopnames don't work anymore (if we decide to just break it)

The patch I just submitted will mark sysopnames as deprecated.

The next step is to go through the code an eliminate all dependencies on sysopnames. I can find it in the following places:

• pywikibot/config2.py
• pywikibot/__init__.py
• pywikibot/login.py
• scripts/flickrripper.py
• scripts/imagetransfer.py
• scripts/login.py
• scripts/version.py
• scripts/watchlist.py
• tests/aspects.py

Next, we should eliminate all places were the "sysop" status of an account is checked (because we should check the user's rights, not the group memberships).

At this point, all that would be left to be done is to devise a strategy for those who need to use different accounts on different wikis (or different accounts for different parts of the same script). The latter is such a rare use case, that I don't think we should prioritize working on it for now.

In T71283#5441831, @Huji wrote:

At this point, all that would be left to be done is to devise a strategy for those who need to use different accounts on different wikis (or different accounts for different parts of the same script). The latter is such a rare use case, that I don't think we should prioritize working on it for now.

user_a = Site(user='UserA')
user_b = Site(user='UserB')

Correct. What I was trying to say was that we should not spend clarifying how to do that (updating documentation, etc) right away.

The only thing needed is to support specifying two accounts, one bot, one sysop and allow to switch between them easily (by a parameter?)

BTW we should also update Stevard rights check (I think it was in site.py) to the new system

In T71283#5443879, @Dvorapa wrote:

The only thing needed is to support specifying two accounts, one bot, one sysop and allow to switch between them easily (by a parameter?)

This violates zero one infinity rule. If sysop is different, why would any other right be different? T71283#1040594

Besides, what is the need for the separation? And how frequent do they appear?

Change 533015 had a related patch set uploaded (by Huji; owner: Huji):
[pywikibot/core@master] Deprecate sysopnames

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/533015

Change 532713 abandoned by Huji:
[WIP] Deprecate sysopnames

Reason:
Moving to 533015 for a minimal approach

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/532713

In T71283#5444154, @zhuyifei1999 wrote:

In T71283#5443879, @Dvorapa wrote:

The only thing needed is to support specifying two accounts, one bot, one sysop and allow to switch between them easily (by a parameter?)

This violates zero one infinity rule. If sysop is different, why would any other right be different? T71283#1040594

Besides, what is the need for the separation? And how frequent do they appear?

This is quite common situation on Czech Wikipedia, one bot account and one sysop account for every sysop bot operator, edits by Pywikibot are made from each of them depending on whether sysop rights are needed or not. I suggest somethng like this (pseudocode, partially similar with what we've had before):

main_username[wikipedia][cs] = 'DvorapaBot'
other_usernames[wikipedia][cs] = ['Dvorapa', 'DvorapaTest']

$ python pwb.py category move -user:Dvorapa -family:wikibooks -lang:sk
$ python pwb.py category move -user:Dvorapa
( = -family:wikipedia -lang:cs)
$ python pwb.py category move
( = -user:DvorapaBot -family:wikipedia -lang:cs)

Another option would be something like this:

usernames[wikipedia][cs] = ['DvorapaBot', 'Dvorapa', 'DvorapaTest']

$ python pwb.py add_text
uses DvorapaBot as this does not need sysop rights
$ python pwb.py delete
tries DvorapaBot, but because of the lack of sysop rights for DvorapaBot it tries Dvorapa instead, successfully as this does require sysop rights

@Urbanecm What would be the best way to solve sysop/bot account dualism in Pywikibot? Currently important changes in this field are being merged to Pywikibot, we should think this through quickly and come up with some ideal solution

This violates zero one infinity rule. If sysop is different, why would any other right be different? T71283#1040594

What is ZOI rule? Never heard about it and Wiki article does not explain it at all. Not sure what do you want to say.

In T71283#5446512, @Dvorapa wrote:

This is quite common situation on Czech Wikipedia, one bot account and one sysop account for every sysop bot operator, edits by Pywikibot are made from each of them depending on whether sysop rights are needed or not. I suggest somethng like this (pseudocode):

1. Why is the separation necessary? It's not like you can't use BotPasswords...
2. T71283#5442078:

user_a = Site(user='UserA')
user_b = Site(user='UserB')
pywikibot.Page(user_a, 'foobar').do_stuffs()
pywikibot.Page(user_b, 'foobar').do_stuffs()

usernames[wikipedia][cs] = ['DvorapaBot', 'Dvorapa', 'DvorapaTest']

Are you proposing to test each user for whether they have rights? This does not feels right to me. Errors should not fail silently by using a fallback, especially in the case when the 'actor' is being changed. If one account is blocked, the bot should stop, not continuing operating on an alt.

In T71283#5446517, @Dvorapa wrote:

What is ZOI rule? Never heard about it and Wiki article does not explain it at all. Not sure what do you want to say.

How about these?

• https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/zero_one_infinity_rule
• http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/Z/Zero-One-Infinity-Rule.html

The point being, if we have dualism, why not tri-ism, quad-ism, quint-ism?

In T71283#5446512, @Dvorapa wrote:

@Urbanecm What would be the best way to solve sysop/bot account dualism in Pywikibot? Currently important changes in this field are being merged to Pywikibot, we should think this through quickly and come up with some ideal solution

Hmm, that's a good question :). Let me introduce my workflow, which can give you some ideas. I have ~/.pywikibot folder, which looks like this:

tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ ll ~/.pywikibot/
total 120
drwxrws--- 2 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 12288 Jan  1  2018 apicache
drwxr-sr-x 2 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 12288 Aug  2 05:08 apicache-py2
drwxr-sr-x 2 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 12288 Aug  8 11:56 apicache-py3
drwxrws--- 2 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot  4096 Mar 29  2016 logs
drwxr-sr-x 5 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot  4096 Apr  2 13:36 oznamovatel
-rw------- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot   974 Jun 16  2016 pywikibot.lwp
drwxr-sr-x 5 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot  4096 Mar 29 17:10 sysop
-rw-r--r-- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot    34 Aug 28 19:19 throttle.ctrl
-rw------- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 17328 Aug  6 20:11 user-config.bot.py
-rw------- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 17143 Jul 26 21:01 user-config.oznamovatel.py
lrwxrwxrwx 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot    18 Dec 16  2017 user-config.py -> user-config.bot.py
-rw------- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot 17337 Jul 26 21:01 user-config.sysop.py
-rw------- 1 tools.urbanecmbot tools.urbanecmbot   101 Apr  2 13:32 user-password.oznamovatel.py
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$

As you can see, I have user-config file for every account I want to use with PWB, and so I have a subdirectory (oznamovatel and sysop in the ls output above), which is basically another .pywikibot folder dedicated for use with another accounts.

• my personal account - user-config.sysop.py (sysop subdir)
• UrbanecmBot - user-config.bot.py (no subdir, main acc)
• Oznamovatel - user-bot.oznamovatel.py (oznamovatel subdir)

In addition to those assets, every non-main account has also a script in ~/bin, see an example:

tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ cat bin/oznamovatelbot
#!/bin/bash
PYWIKIBOT2_DIR=$HOME/.pywikibot/oznamovatel python3 "$@"
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$

Then, if I want to run a script saved under announce.py as User:Oznamovatel, I do oznamovatelbot announce.py. The same principle applies to my personal account, and in theory, I can add any account to this setup quickly and easily, I just need to copy the scripts and configs and edit a little.

Keep in mind my bots aren't object orientated, [nnc.py](https://github.com/wikimedia/labs-tools-urbanecmbot/blob/master/cswiki/userbots/announcers/nnc.py) is a real example.

To let me work how I work now (and have pywikibot do what I need it to, not me do what pywikibot needs me to let me use itself), I'd appreciate something like this.

accounts = {
    "oznamovatel": {
        "username": "Oznamovatel",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    },
    "urbanecmbot": {
        "username": "UrbanecmBot",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    }
}
usernames['wikipedia']['cs'] = [  'urbanecmbot', 'oznamovatelbot' ] # both urbanecmbot and oznamovatelbot used
usernames['wikipedia']['en'] = [  'urbanecmbot' ] # only urbanecmbot used

and then in shell:

tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ python3 nnc.py --user=urbanecmbot # PWB catches the user parameter internally, and runs the script as UrbanecmBot
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ python3 nnc.py --user=oznamovatel # PWB catches the user parameter internally, and runs the script as Oznamovatel
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$

That would allow anyone to use any number of account in one PWB instance/config, and use one script with any of those as desired.

Less ideal (I'd probably alias it up to make it simple without much typing), but also good would be:

tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ PYWIKIBOT_USER=urbanecmbot python3 nnc.py # PWB catches the PYWIKIBOT_USER env variable internally, and runs the script as UrbanecmBot
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$ PYWIKIBOT_USER=oznamovatel python3 nnc.py # PWB catches the PYWIKIBOT_USER env variable internally, and runs the script as Oznamovatel
tools.urbanecmbot@tools-sgebastion-07 ~
$

Please note this is merely an end-user wish and I've little to none idea regarding the rest of PWB users' workflow,

In T71283#5446553, @zhuyifei1999 wrote:

In T71283#5446512, @Dvorapa wrote:

This is quite common situation on Czech Wikipedia, one bot account and one sysop account for every sysop bot operator, edits by Pywikibot are made from each of them depending on whether sysop rights are needed or not. I suggest somethng like this (pseudocode):

1. Why is the separation necessary? It's not like you can't use BotPasswords...

To put it simply, Czech Wikipedia is less developped than the English one speaking of policies, which leaves us with only a policy about how a human can become an admin, but none policy about how can a computer/bot become an admin. Bureacurats don't want to implement a precedent with granting sysop rights to alterego accounts, which is what bot account kinda-is. For instance, all my adminbot activity is distinguished only by summary prefixed with Bot, and runs from my own account.

BotPasswords can be used, but I use an owner-only OAuth token (probably allowed to do everything on behalf of the bot, and carefully selected actions on behalf of my personal account).

2. T71283#5442078:

user_a = Site(user='UserA')
user_b = Site(user='UserB')
pywikibot.Page(user_a, 'foobar').do_stuffs()
pywikibot.Page(user_b, 'foobar').do_stuffs()

usernames[wikipedia][cs] = ['DvorapaBot', 'Dvorapa', 'DvorapaTest']

Are you proposing to test each user for whether they have rights? This does not feels right to me. Errors should not fail silently by using a fallback, especially in the case when the 'actor' is being changed. If one account is blocked, the bot should stop, not continuing operating on an alt.

Delete must be done with an user account that has delete, not ordinary bot - it is not going to succeed. I'd go with something slighly different, see above.

In T71283#5446517, @Dvorapa wrote:

What is ZOI rule? Never heard about it and Wiki article does not explain it at all. Not sure what do you want to say.

How about these?

• https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/zero_one_infinity_rule
• http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/Z/Zero-One-Infinity-Rule.html

The point being, if we have dualism, why not tri-ism, quad-ism, quint-ism?

I believe he wants to propose to extend the idea of two accounts in pywikibot to any number of accounts, regardless their privilege. This is actually something that I consider important for my workflow, see above. {{support}}

I also have got and use several account for various things and I miss a way to simply switch between them. BTW Pywikibot tests miss the way to simply switch between several accounts (OAuth, BotPasswords, regular password) as well.

In T71283#5446608, @Urbanecm wrote:

user-config.py

accounts = {
    "oznamovatel": {
        "username": "Oznamovatel",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    },
    "urbanecmbot": {
        "username": "UrbanecmBot",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    }
}
usernames['wikipedia']['cs'] = [  'urbanecmbot', 'oznamovatelbot' ] # both urbanecmbot and oznamovatelbot used
usernames['wikipedia']['en'] = [  'urbanecmbot' ] # only urbanecmbot used

I like the idea of supporting OAuth tokens for an infinite number of users per site. However, given that the user is provided by command line, and that the family/lang tuple is provided in the site constructor, what is the point of providing a user list per site? It is not like pywikibot will attempt to fallback through this list.

To put it simply, Czech Wikipedia is less developped than the English one speaking of policies, which leaves us with only a policy about how a human can become an admin, but none policy about how can a computer/bot become an admin. Bureacurats don't want to implement a precedent with granting sysop rights to alterego accounts, which is what bot account kinda-is. For instance, all my adminbot activity is distinguished only by summary prefixed with Bot, and runs from my own account.

This is risking your own personal account getting blocked for bot activity, in the case that it malfunctions.

In T71283#5446611, @Dvorapa wrote:

BTW Pywikibot tests miss the way to simply switch between several accounts (OAuth, BotPasswords, regular password) as well.

The login manager is too stateful. You want PEP 554.

In T71283#5446690, @zhuyifei1999 wrote:

In T71283#5446608, @Urbanecm wrote:

user-config.py

accounts = {
    "oznamovatel": {
        "username": "Oznamovatel",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    },
    "urbanecmbot": {
        "username": "UrbanecmBot",
        "oauth": [ consumer key, consumer secret, client key, client secret ]
    }
}
usernames['wikipedia']['cs'] = [  'urbanecmbot', 'oznamovatelbot' ] # both urbanecmbot and oznamovatelbot used
usernames['wikipedia']['en'] = [  'urbanecmbot' ] # only urbanecmbot used

I like the idea of supporting OAuth tokens for an infinite number of users per site. However, given that the user is provided by command line, and that the family/lang tuple is provided in the site constructor, what is the point of providing a user list per site? It is not like pywikibot will attempt to fallback through this list.

True that, it can be just one username per site, the preferred one? But listing that usernames can be actually useful as a safeguard, to not allow an username that's defined, but not allowed in usernames list, in case I don't want to use one username somewhere for some reason. Feel free to make it only default username, that's fine as well, just thinking loud :).

To put it simply, Czech Wikipedia is less developped than the English one speaking of policies, which leaves us with only a policy about how a human can become an admin, but none policy about how can a computer/bot become an admin. Bureacurats don't want to implement a precedent with granting sysop rights to alterego accounts, which is what bot account kinda-is. For instance, all my adminbot activity is distinguished only by summary prefixed with Bot, and runs from my own account.

This is risking your own personal account getting blocked for bot activity, in the case that it malfunctions.

I'm not saying that's the best way, I'm just saying that's the reason why it is separated :).

In T71283#5446694, @Urbanecm wrote:

True that, it can be just one username per site, the preferred one? But listing that usernames can be actually useful as a safeguard, to not allow an username that's defined, but not allowed in usernames list, in case I don't want to use one username somewhere for some reason. Feel free to make it only default username, that's fine as well, just thinking loud :).

How about:

• If it is not defined: No constraint, no defaults. One of my web tools use pywikibot this way and uses OAuth tokens from mwoauth to switch between users.
• If it is a string: No constraint, default to string value. I use a few bots that switch to another non-default user by simply setting user= in site constructor
• If it is a set of 0 strings: Unsatisfible constraint. Non-loginable, read-only.
• If it is a set of 1 string: Constraint to default, default to string value.
• If it is a set of multiple strings: Constraint to the set, no defaults.

I don't understand. Can you show me examples?

This is assuming the default family/lang is Commons. The same applies to any other site if the parameters passed to the Site constructor matches any case given to the usernames dict.

del usernames['commons']:

>>> pywikibot.Site().username()
[Error about username not set]
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot0').username()
'MyBot0'

usernames['commons']['commons'] = 'MyBot1':

>>> pywikibot.Site().username()
'MyBot1'
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot0').username()
'MyBot0'

usernames['commons']['commons'] = []:

>>> pywikibot.Site().username()
[Error about username not set]
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot0').username()
[Error about username constraint not satisfied]

usernames['commons']['commons'] = ['MyBot1']:

>>> pywikibot.Site().username()
'MyBot1'
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot1').username()
'MyBot1'
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot0').username()
[Error about username constraint not satisfied]

usernames['commons']['commons'] = ['MyBot1', 'MyBot2']:

>>> pywikibot.Site().username()
[Error about username not set]
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot1').username()
'MyBot1'
>>> pywikibot.Site(user='MyBot0').username()
[Error about username constraint not satisfied]

The list is not the focus. The container will be turned into a set object for de-duplication, and the order does not matter anyways.

LGTM @zhuyifei1999

Change 533015 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] Deprecate sysopnames

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/533015

I officially announced the deprecation in https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/pywikibot/2019-September/009955.html

Change 534927 had a related patch set uploaded (by Huji; owner: Huji):
[pywikibot/core@master] Deprecate the ability to login with a sysop account

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/534927

Change 534927 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] Deprecate the ability to login with a secondary sysop account

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/534927

Change 565624 had a related patch set uploaded (by Xqt; owner: Xqt):
[pywikibot/core@master] [IMPR] Replace @must_be with @need_right

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/565624

Change 209503 abandoned by Xqt:
[WIP] Replace @must_be with @need_right

Reason:
In favour of https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/pywikibot/core/ /565624/ and due to very outdated base

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/209503

Change 568058 had a related patch set uploaded (by Mpaa; owner: Mpaa):
[pywikibot/core@master] Remove AS_SYSOP from enum

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/568058

Change 568058 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] Remove AS_SYSOP from LoginStatus enum

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/568058

Change 568504 had a related patch set uploaded (by Xqt; owner: Xqt):
[pywikibot/core@master] [bugfix] remove sysop assignment it Site interface

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/568504

Change 568504 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] [bugfix] remove sysop assignment in Site interfaces

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/568504

Change 565624 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] [IMPR] Replace @must_be with @need_right

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/565624

Change 584555 had a related patch set uploaded (by Dvorapa; owner: Dvorapa):
[pywikibot/core@master] [cleanup] replace deprecated sysopnames in imagetransfer.py

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/584555

Change 584562 had a related patch set uploaded (by Dvorapa; owner: Dvorapa):
[pywikibot/core@master] [cleanup] Remove sysopnames check from tests/aspects.py

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/584562

Change 584555 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] [cleanup] replace deprecated sysopnames in imagetransfer.py

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/584555

Change 672448 had a related patch set uploaded (by Xqt; owner: Xqt):
[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Rename tests 'user' attribute to 'login'

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/672448

Change 672448 merged by jenkins-bot:
[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Rename tests 'user' attribute to 'login'

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/672448

Change 584562 abandoned by Xqt:

[pywikibot/core@master] [cleanup] Remove sysopnames check from tests/aspects.py

Reason:

Already solved

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/584562

Ah, I see. So I am sorry.

Change 768195 had a related patch set uploaded (by Xqt; author: Xqt):

[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Add ability to require special rights for tests

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/768195

Change 768195 merged by jenkins-bot:

[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Add ability to require special rights for tests

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/768195

Change 768198 had a related patch set uploaded (by Xqt; author: Xqt):

[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Remove sysop TestCase attribute

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/768198

Change 768198 merged by jenkins-bot:

[pywikibot/core@master] [tests] Remove sysop TestCase attribute

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/768198